Newbie Here w/ a `54 Commander Question

[Hanks 54]

Hi Everyone. You've got a Studebaker virgin here is you'll pardon the expression. I just "inherited" a 1954 Studebaker, 4 door Commander. The car was originally bought by my Great Grandfather and I just got it from my Grandfather. I know a bit about mechanics since both my Grandfather and my Dad were both pretty good mechanics themselves but I'm kind of having to go this project on my own. So, my first question has to do with the electrical system. From reading some of the other posts on here, I'm guessing the problem I'm having is the voltage regulator. The engine is still a six volt system and while the battery is showing around 8.25V, I can barely get the engine to turn over twice before it starts acting like the battery is dead. How can I trouble shoot the regulator? Since I don't know how much voltage should be being passed to the starter, I'm kind of stuck. Don't laugh too hard at me, I learn pretty quick. I just need a couple of tips to help me along.

Thanks
Hank and My 1954 Commander

[53k]

quote:Originally posted by Hanks 54

Hi Everyone. You've got a Studebaker virgin here is you'll pardon the expression. I just "inherited" a 1954 Studebaker, 4 door Commander. The car was originally bought by my Great Grandfather and I just got it from my Grandfather. I know a bit about mechanics since both my Grandfather and my Dad were both pretty good mechanics themselves but I'm kind of having to go this project on my own. So, my first question has to do with the electrical system. From reading some of the other posts on here, I'm guessing the problem I'm having is the voltage regulator. The engine is still a six volt system and while the battery is showing around 8.25V, I can barely get the engine to turn over twice before it starts acting like the battery is dead. How can I trouble shoot the regulator? Since I don't know how much voltage should be being passed to the starter, I'm kind of stuck. Don't laugh too hard at me, I learn pretty quick. I just need a couple of tips to help me along.

Could be a bad starter solenoid or a bad starter, but the best thing is to start cleaning all the electrical connections beginning with the battery terminals and pay special attention to all grounds. It could be as simple as a corroded ground strap from the engine to the battery. Be sure you remember that this is a POSITIVE ground system. Don't hook it up like modern 12-volts.




Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia. '64 Daytona Wagonaire, '64 Daytona convertible, '53 Commander Starliner, Museum R-4 engine, '62 Gravely Model L, '72 Gravely Model 430

[sweetolbob]

Hank

Welcome.

You have one of the best old cars you can find. A decent vehicle handed down from folks you want to remember.

I'm not the resident battery expert, but you may want to count the caps on the battery. If 3 it a 6V, if 4 is an 8 v. That was the way the old style were built. Newer, not so much. If it's an 8 volt, it probably needs a charge or is probably just old.

If it's only the battery you are in good shape.

Please use the search portion and look up "starting sitting engines" to be sure the engine will not create expensive issues if not well prepped.

Bob

[Dick Steinkamp]

The voltage regulator controls the current from the generator to the battery...not from the battery to the starter. The voltage regulator is probably not the starting problem.

I'd have the battery load tested to make sure it is good.

You should have HEAVY battery cables. A 6V needs much heavier cables than a 12v system. Connections should be clean and tight.


Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

[Hanks 54]

Thats all GREAT information!!! I've already replaced the battery cables and the battery has four caps which would indicate an eight volt battery. I also didn't know about the POSITIVE ground setup either. Again more GREAT information. I know some things I'll be looking at this evening when I head over to my grandparents house. Please, if anyone has more info I should know, no matter how obvious, hit me with it. The more brains the merrier!!!

Thanks
Hank and My 1954 Commander

[Dick Steinkamp]

quote:Originally posted by Hanks 54
I've already replaced the battery cables

If you replaced them with made up ones from an auto parts store, they are probably 12V cables and way too small for a 6-8 volt system. They should be 00-01 gauge. 12v cables are generally 4 gauge.

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

[jclary]

Hank, I checked on my maps and it looks like you are not too far from Houston, TX. Perhaps someone on the forum knows of some Studebaker Club member in your area that is knowledgeable about the mechanics of your car. If I were close, I would be happy to come and assist you in evaluating what you have. Just don't rush. Shop manuals, body, and chassis manuals are available for your car. I have bought cars that had been sitting for years. Cleaned the leaves and squirrel nest out of the engine bay, scraped the corrosion off the points, put in a battery, pumped up the tires, poured in some gas and driven them home. If you take a little time, you can have fun, lessen the chances of becoming discouraged, and open a whole new world of fun and adventure. If anyone reading this knows of a nearby member who could give Hank some assistance and encouragement, please let him know. Welcome to the forum Hank and please join the national club and your local state chapter as soon as possible.

John Clary
Greer, SC

Life... is what happens as you are making plans.
SDC member since 1975

[BobGlasscock]

Hank, welcome to the forum and join the club quick! I would have guessed that a more knowledgeable person would have suggested this already, but the battery being drawn down is probably not the problem, it's the result. I'd check out that starter for the load it is creating on the battery. Maybe now that I said it, some of the experts will pipe in with more specific advice.

'50 Champion, 1 family owner

[Tom Bredehoft]

Hank, I'd like to welcome you, too. What Bob, above, might be talking about.....As the starter wears, the bushings in the end, which keep it centered in the starter, wear, usually on the bottom, allowing the armature to sag. If it sags enough, the surface of the armature rubs against the surface of the windings on the bottom. After all, it's all about magnetic attraction in there. Once they touch, friction takes over, keeping the armature from turning quickly. It will turn, but not fast enough to start the car. IF this is the case, replacing the bushings will help a great deal. This is where a professional rebuild will help immensely. I had this problem with my '53, once there were new bushings, the engine spun, almost always starting on the second cylinder to come into compression.

We're here to help you, Studebakers are fun, but problems we all have faced are often new to people like you.

[img=left]http://www.alink.com/personal/tbredehoft/Avatar1.jpg[/img=left]
Tom Bredehoft
'53 Commander Coupe (since 1959)
'55 President (6H Y6) State Sedan
(Under Construction 617 hrs.)
'05 Legacy Ltd Wagon
All Indiana built cars

[chamberlainbandad]

the first thing you should buy is a factory service manual, this will pay for itself in about the first four hours of working on this car and good luck

ap

[Hanks 54]

Well, I worked on her some yesterday. I changed out both battery connections with 01 gauge wire and I cleaned up the connections points on all four points as well. What I'm seeing is that the lights are bright enough that I can tell they are getting good voltage, everything else in the car is working fine as well. However, I'm still not getting it to turn over. At this point I'm thinking it has to be the starter is frozen up. Where the car is now, I can't get it jacked up so I can get to the starter so I'm going to have to wait until I get it home to start tinkering on that. So my next move is to get a couple of new tires on it for the ride home(the current ones are dry rotted)and then get my membership taken care of in the local Studebaker Club. If anyone has any other ideas I should try by all means let me know and I really appreciate all the helpful hints.

Thanks
Hank and My 1954 Commander

[N8N]

since you say you can't access the starter, I'm guessing that you haven't checked the cable from the solenoid to the starter motor. That's another potential trouble spot, although if you have to get under there I might "while you're in there" pull the starter motor and tear it down for a rattle-can rebuild, check the brushes, brighten the commutator, wipe a little grease in the bushings, etc.

If you find a badly worn bushing in the starter motor I'd replace that before going any farther, and of course bench test it with jumper cables before reinstalling.

good luck

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight

http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[Hanks 54]

Thanks Nate, I'll be sure to check that too. I already know I'll need to rewire just about everything. All of the wiring under the hood is the original factor installed wiring and has several worn spots where the wire is visible or has been taped over. But again thanks for that tip, I'm making notes as I go of the things I need to double check, repair and improve on.

Thanks
Hank and My 1954 Commander